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Minutes, 7 April 1843, as Reported by William Clayton

Source Note

Special conference of the church, Minutes, [, Hancock Co., IL, 7 Apr. 1843]; handwriting of ; three pages; Historian’s Office, General Church Minutes, CHL. Includes redactions.
Bifolium measuring 12¼ × 8¾ inches (31 × 22 cm), with thirty-six horizontal gray lines. The document was folded for filing. At an unknown time, an unidentified scribe made numerical calculations on the verso of the second leaf.
A title, “Pratts Sermon”, was inscribed on the document by , who served as JS’s scribe from December 1841 until JS’s death in June 1844 and served as church historian from December 1842 until his own death in March 1854. In the mid-twentieth century, the document was included in a miscellaneous minutes collection that was a vestige of the genre-based filing method used by the Church Historian’s Office (now CHL) in the first half of the twentieth century. This document genre collection contained many documents that subsequently formed the basis for the General Church Minutes collection that was cataloged in 1994. Richards’s title and the document’s inclusion in the General Church Minutes collection indicate continuous institutional custody.

Footnotes

  1. [1]

    JS, Journal, 13 Dec. 1841 and 21 Dec. 1842; Orson Spencer, “Death of Our Beloved Brother Willard Richards,” Deseret News (Salt Lake City), 16 Mar. 1854, [2].

    Deseret News. Salt Lake City. 1850–.

  2. [2]

    See the full bibliographic entry for Historian’s Office, General Church Minutes, 1839–1877, in the CHL catalog.

Historical Introduction

During the 7 April 1843 afternoon meeting of the ’s special , held from 6 to 9 April 1843 in , Illinois, gave a discourse on the Millennium and the concept of resurrection, which prompted a response and correction from JS later in the meeting. The congregation filled the temporary floor on the main level of the , with some listeners standing on the unfinished temple walls. After the meeting opened at 2:30 p.m. with a hymn followed by a prayer offered by , Pratt discussed the millennial beliefs of Baptist preacher and his followers, arguing that contemporary revelation through a prophet was necessary to comprehend biblical prophecies. The apostle then sought to reconcile scientific ideas about matter perpetually reconstituting itself with religious beliefs about the literal resurrection of the body by suggesting that a core part of the body remained constant throughout life, death, and resurrection. Pratt left open the possibility that some material components of one body might be reconstituted within another body, although he invited JS to correct him if necessary. Apostle followed Pratt at 3:25 p.m. and discussed ways that Latter-day Saint beliefs differed from those of other religious groups.
At 4:45 p.m., JS briefly took the stand to offer a correction to ’s discourse. While praising the topic as “a glorious subject” and indicating that “the principle of Mr Pratt was correct,” JS nevertheless stated that he “care[d] not what the theories of man are.” He explained that “their is no fundamental principle belonging to a human System” that would ever become part of another human body, whether “in this world. or the world to come.” Additionally, JS insisted that “we have the testimony that God will raise us up & he has power to do it.” After JS concluded his comments, the choir sang a hymn, and apostle closed the meeting with a prayer.
Conference clerk captured uneven minutes for the meeting, focusing primarily on ’s discourse and JS’s response. Clayton mentioned ’s sermon only briefly and omitted significant contextual information such as when the meeting opened and closed and the names of those offering prayers. He also neglected to identify JS as the speaker responding to . Part of Pratt’s discourse that treated the identity of the “Ancient of days” mentioned in the biblical book of Daniel was subsequently published in expanded form in the Times and Seasons.

Footnotes

  1. [1]

    JS, Journal, 6–7 Apr. 1843.

  2. [2]

    JS, Journal, 7 Apr. 1843.

  3. [3]

    JS, Journal, 7 Apr. 1843.

  4. [4]

    Clayton, Journal, 6 Apr. 1843; see also Historical Introduction to Minutes and Discourses, 6–7 Apr. 1843.

    Clayton, William. Journals, 1842–1845. CHL.

  5. [5]

    “The Ancient of Days,” Times and Seasons, 15 May 1843, 4:204; see also Daniel 7:9, 13–14.

    Times and Seasons. Commerce/Nauvoo, IL. Nov. 1839–Feb. 1846.

Asterisk (*) denotes a "featured" version, which includes an introduction and annotation. *Minutes, 7 April 1843, as Reported by William Clayton Minutes, 7 April 1843, as Reported by Willard Richards Journal, December 1842–June 1844; Book 2, 10 March 1843–14 July 1843 History Draft [1 March–31 December 1843] History, 1838–1856, volume D-1 [1 August 1842–1 July 1843] “History of Joseph Smith”

Page [3]

The flesh, bones &c are constantly changing— once in 8 or 10 years— not the same body at the end of 10— the argument to weather— in 70 years changes 7 times. we admit all truth— I dont know but does change his system in about 9 or 10 I believe it. difference with authors If does change in 8 or 10 years he would have matter to frame 7 bodies. they say the matter that composes our bodies has an other— in the res they will be contending. matter undergoes changes. If a man goes to earth the substance form vegetable— animals— by other human systems— constantly— they say if a man rise &c they will quarrel. Easily solved— Do not believe that over 3/4 that is composed of animal food or was ever organised. purely vegetable. in the Res— if the s undergoes as many changes— these may be one or two parts which never was organized in another left which will be another body. It can be solved if we trace it far enough. If he receive the same matter he had 50 years before death. the resident of the body constitu[tes] the being— A house may be repaired over & over untill there is not an original stick left— the same house— so with human system. the same being.
gratified for the privilege— engaged in a work of vast importance— work will ever— fills my heart with joy— have endeavourd to inform their minds on all subjects calculated to.
[JS:] One point in lacking. There is no fundamental principle belonging to any one human being that ever goes into another. Does not matter how many changes the body undergoes. we care not for the philosophy of the world. There is power enough in the Almighty— to make us a body in the resurrection like this body & that is enough If we do not abide com [coming?]— we get a res. The principles of our bodies do not change into another. [9 lines blank] [p. [3]]
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Source Note

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Page [3]

Document Information

Related Case Documents
Editorial Title
Minutes, 7 April 1843, as Reported by William Clayton
ID #
10829
Total Pages
4
Print Volume Location
JSP, D12:174–180
Handwriting on This Page
  • William Clayton

Footnotes

  1. [19]

    Willard Richards recorded Pratt as saying, “I do not beleive that more than 3/4 of our bodies is composed of animal organizati[o]n. but is purely vegetable.” Franklin D. Richards quoted Pratt thus: “Only about 3/4 of the matter contained in one creature could be converted to the use of another.” (JS, Journal, 7 Apr. 1843; Richards, “Scriptural Items,” [16].)

    Richards, Franklin D. Scriptural Items, ca. 1841–1844. CHL. MS 4409.

  2. [20]

    It is unclear whether Clayton’s abbreviation “s” refers to “substance” or “system.”

  3. [21]

    Orson Pratt’s argument here is similar to an argument made by his brother Parley P. Pratt in an 1841 editorial in the Millennial Star, the church’s newspaper published in England. Parley Pratt summarized some objections to a literal resurrection, conceding that “the whole matter which constitutes the physical system of the human body at any given time is said to pass away in exchange for new matter to the same amount, once in about ten years,” resulting in a given human having possessed and discarded enough matter for seven bodies after seven decades. Parley noted that matter passed from the earth, to plants, to animals, to humans, and back again, raising the possibility that “in the resurrection one individual would necessarily claim some of the same particles of matter as another, because both had once possessed some of the same particles.” Despite these contentions, he argued that it was “consciousness that constitutes the same person in reality, both in his own estimation and that of all his acquaintances” and that “even God himself, who is the standard of philosophical and all other truths, will recognise him as the same individual, and will judge him for the deeds done in the old body.” Parley concluded that Latter-day Saints had “reconciled or harmonized the revelations of God with the laws of nature.” (Parley P. Pratt, “Philosophy of the Resurrection,” Millennial Star, Nov. 1841, 2:97–100.)

    Latter-day Saints’ Millennial Star. Manchester, England, 1840–1842; Liverpool, 1842–1932; London, 1932–1970.

  4. [22]

    TEXT: This last sentence may have been part of JS’s correction of Pratt, although Clayton attached it to William Smith’s discourse.

  5. [23]

    Willard Richards’s account of this meeting clarified that JS began speaking at this point. (JS, Journal, 7 Apr. 1843.)

  6. [24]

    Franklin D. Richards quoted JS as saying that “no fundamental principle of one creature can be changed to another Creature.” (Richards, “Scriptural Items,” [16].)

    Richards, Franklin D. Scriptural Items, ca. 1841–1844. CHL. MS 4409.

  7. [25]

    See Malachi 3:2.

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